What You Should Know Before Getting a License to Carry

SWAN VALLEY - The National Rifle Association (NRA) has developed a motto recently, "The only thing that is going to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun." Condon resident and local expert Philip Gregory is putting his 20 years of military experience and 13 years as a law enforcement officer to work helping private citizens understand what it means to be the good guy and learn the when, where and how to carry a concealed weapon.

While the only required training to obtain a concealed carry permit is hunter's safety, Gregory believes the responsibility of carrying a deadly weapon for the purpose of protection is far greater than what can be taught by hunter's safety. In his course, he teaches the responsibility, duty and obligations inherent with concealed carry and how to be legally, morally and ethically justified should a person use lethal force.

Gregory served 20 years in the United States Air Force with 13 years of active duty and seven years in the Montana Air National Guard. He worked 13 years in law enforcement in Atlanta, Geo.; Pocatello, Idaho; Anniston, Ala.; and at the Federal Reserve bank in Helena, Mont. He made nine arrests at gunpoint but has never fired his handgun at another human being.

Gregory is a certified NRA instructor. He and his fellow instructor, a retired marine from Helena, wrote their own lesson plan for the course earning praise from the Lewis and Clark County Sheriff Leo Dutton as the best he had seen.

Gregory has taught in Helena for four years and in the Seeley-Swan last year and this year because, "I'm totally convinced that there are too many people that are carrying hand guns, either open to view or concealed carry, that don't have a clue what they are doing."

In Montana it is legal to openly carry a firearm anywhere except in the city limits of Helena. Gregory does not see a reason to carry a handgun open to view by the general public.

"I love guns but if I see someone walking in the city with a side arm strapped to him, I ask what is he trying to prove?" said Gregory. "I think he is making a bad example [of himself]. If he intends to use that for his personal protection, anyone that intends to do him harm will do so before he knows what has happened."

Gregory is strongly in favor of concealed carry.

"It's like having a fire extinguisher. Not that you think the house will catch on fire but just in case it does," said Gregory. "Carrying a concealed fire arm falls in the same category. Why carry concealed? Just in case the worse thing imaginable happens. I cannot image living with myself if someone put someone very near and dear to me in serious, horrible danger and I was helpless and defenseless to do anything about it."

In his class, Gregory stresses the tremendous responsibility someone has when carrying a concealed weapon. Students learn how to carry the firearm so it remains concealed, how to draw, fire and use the firearm, and how to deal with the aftermath of the situation.

"If you think the situation is over once you get done shooting, you are horribly mistaken. Your troubles have only begun," said Gregory.

If someone is not legally justified for using their weapon, they can be prosecuted for manslaughter up to first-degree murder.

Gregory shared two examples of lethal force being used where the shooter thought they were justified but are now in prison. In 2014, a retired Lieutenant Army Colonel was robbed at gunpoint in his pharmacy that has been robbed several times before. The Colonel shot the one man and dropped him. He then pursued and shot at the other robber as he fled. Upon returning to the store, the Colonel reloaded and shot the one in the store five or six more times. He was convicted of first-degree murder and is serving a life sentence.

"You should never shoot to kill, you shoot to stop the threat," said Gregory. "If you shoot to kill that shows malice on your part. The only thing you are doing is protecting yourself or an innocent third party." It is illegal to shoot someone as they are running away no matter what they have done prior to their retreat.

The second example happened within the past six years. A man was walking his dogs on a rural trail and saw a person approaching him that looked odd. The person attacked him with his fists. The person being attacked pulled his gun and killed his attacker.

"You cannot use deadly force against someone who is not using deadly force against you. If two men are in a fist fight neither can use deadly force against the other until, unless [one] can stipulate [the other] was using deadly force [a man hitting a woman is an exception and a woman can use deadly force on a man and be justified]." Gregory explained this includes being able to articulate and have the physical proof that deadly force was being used.

In this case, Gregory said that the attacker had a screwdriver in his back pocket that he had used to murder three women three days before. However, the person being attacked didn't know he had a screwdriver in his back pocket, nor did he know about the previous murders. Therefore he could not use that information in his defense. The one who used his concealed weapon went to jail for manslaughter.

Gregory provides his students with what to say, how to say it, how to preserve a scene and how to help law enforcement identify the good guy and the bad guy instantly on arrival of the shooting. Regardless of whether someone is convicted of a crime or not, Gregory estimates a minimum cost of $30,000 to $50,000 for legal fees to defend against a civil suit that is almost certain to happen after any shooting even if no criminal charges are filed against the shooter.

"Before you pull that trigger you are going to have to ask yourself, is shooting that person worth $30,000 out of my pocket. Well, my life is worth that, so the only time that a civilian can shoot another human being is to save their own life or that of a third person, or to prevent grave, bodily injury. And you better be able to show that after the event is over."

Gregory also cautions someone from introducing a gun into a situation unless they are willing to use it.

"If a person is close enough for me to touch them, and they are pointing a gun at me, they are in more danger than I am," said Gregory. "Do not ever let a person that you are uncomfortable with be close enough to touch you. If you do and the person with the gun pointed at them has any training at all, they will take the gun away from you."

Montana law allows someone to use deadly force to protect the life of a third party. It is not legal to take someone's life over property. In Montana, it is illegal to have a firearm, even with a concealed permit, on school grounds, in a restaurant that serves alcohol, in a city, state or federal government building or in a financial institution.

Gregory believes the laws should be changed that restrict concealed carry in restaurants and schools. Gregory believes the law that prohibits the carrying of a concealed firearm in a restaurant the serves alcohol, should be changed to "prohibit the consumption of alcohol while carrying a concealed firearm. He feels that school employees, who have had the proper training and are willing, should be allowed to carry a concealed weapon.

"I would strongly encourage any school employee [that is willing] to get the training needed, get a concealed carry permit and carry while at work [should the law be changed]," said Gregory. "This nation spends billions to protect the President and his family and other government officials, yet our kids are totally unprotected at school; that is nonsense. The NRA has developed a motto recently; the only thing that is going to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. That is a very true statement and no one can argue that point."

Gregory offers his Concealed Carry of Firearms Training at students' request. The training consists of up to seven hours of training in the classroom and 30-60 minutes of training on the range for $100 per student. To schedule a class call Gregory at 406-754-1235 or email mtman3006@yahoo.com.